Mattice Boets

LEGENDARY INTERVIEW

Design Legends ("DL") had the distinct honour to interview legendary designer Mattice Boets ("MB") for their original perspective and innovative approach to design as well as their creative lifestyle, we are very pleased to share our interview with our distinguished readers.

DL: Could you please tell us a bit about your design background and education?

MB : I’ve been in industrial, architectural, digital and fine arts related pursuits for the last six years, completing my award-winning high school graduation project in Industrial Arts in 2017. I discovered my passion for industrial design during my two years of studying Industrial Arts at Pikoh high school in Belgium. I’m currently studying Industrial Product Design at Howest in Kortrijk, Belgium to continue my pursuits in design. Prior to my two years of studying Industrial Arts at Pikoh high school, I also studied visual and architectural arts for two years. During this time period, I also attended the Academy For Fine Arts at Hasselt, Belgium as an additional study during four years. In this course, I came into contact with software such as Photoshop, Illustrator and After Effects for the first time. Apart from my studies in art and design-related disciplines, I have been raised in a very creative environment that was stimulated by my parents since birth. Drawing, painting, building landscapes, houses and other creations with Lego was my daily activity. This habit continued over the years and has evolved to a more design and digital-oriented way of creating. I would like to think of myself as a designer, but of what I don’t yet know. I’ve mostly designed products over the last four years, this is mainly due to my choice of studying product design rather than other disciplines such as architecture. I believe my upbringing and continued interest in art and design have eventually let me become a designer and creator.

DL: What motivates you to design in general, why did you become a designer?

MB : I've always loved creating and inventing things. In high school, I had the option to study Industrial Arts. This course caught my eye because it gave you the opportunity to design and invent products yourself. This was the first time that I really came in contact with design. I feel lucky to have found a course of study that I enjoy doing at a young age which has now turned into a passion.

DL: Did you choose to become a designer, or you were forced to become one?

MB : I choose to become a designer. I studied Industrial Arts in high school and continued to pursuit Industrial Product Design at Howest University in Kortrijk, Belgium. I'm currently in the second year of my course.

DL: What do you design, what type of designs do you wish to design more of?

MB : I’ve mainly designed products such as clocks, tables, vases, bottle openers, portable Bluetooth speakers and also a luxurious outdoor living space shaped like a cocoon to relax in. I would like to design more products in which there is an opportunity for doing it differently and that aren’t bound to a specific shape in which there is very little room for variation and innovation. Additionally, I enjoy designing products or objects that have a use and function besides their visual aesthetics. This allows me to rethink its shape and its use case, which may result in unusual yet practical designs. Surprisingly, most products have these characteristics, so I won’t be running out of products to design any time soon.

DL: What should young designers do to become a design legend like you?

MB : I really don’t feel like a design legend but thank you for the kind words. Perhaps someday I will. I think it’s most important to pursue something that really fits you as a person. This will be different for everyone. So, I wouldn’t advise to pursuit the title, but rather your own passion.

DL: What distinguishes between a good designer and a great designer?

MB : A good designer is someone who designs something well on a functional and fundamental level. A great designer is someone who goes beyond what anyone was expecting or asking and does so in a way that the design empowers people and creates a positive impact on society as a whole.

DL: What makes a good design a really good design, how do you evaluate good design?

MB : For me, a really good design adds something significantly positive to our world that we haven’t seen before and has a place in our world. Good design is about making something completely new or in a way that hasn’t been explored before that has a compelling reason and meaningful purpose for its existing.

DL: What is the value of good design? Why should everyone invest in good design?

MB : Everyone values design differently, for some it may be about the aesthetics or the brand while for others it’s about the emotional connection or for practical reasons. Therefore, I don’t believe it’s possible to put a value on good design. However, good design has the opportunity to empower our world as a whole. I believe it would be great to be able to take part in this by investing in good design. Additionally, if a design has a meaningful purpose that is of significance it is likely to have the potential to be very successful because it’s something that people haven’t yet had the opportunity to acquire themselves since such a design didn’t exist yet.

DL: What would you design and who would you design for if you had the time?

MB : I would like to complete my Reverse clock design and realize the project together with an established designer brand. If I had the time I would also like to create a Reverse watch design and realize that project too.

DL: What is the dream project you haven’t yet had time to realize?

MB : A dream project would be to design a floatation tank together with Ross Lovegrove. A floatation tank is a closed cocoon shaped bath that you float weightlessly and timelessly in with water and Epsom salt at skin temperature. It’s a moment of pure peace and allows the body to completely regenerate. My father, Geert Boets, is the founder of The Great Boost floatation center and has given me the opportunity to design a floatation tank in the near future. I personally believe the project very much aligns with me as a designer and as a person and I think it also aligns very well with the approach that Ross Lovegrove has on design. The mountain living unit called Alpine Capsule, designed by Ross Lovegrove very much reminds me of how a floatation tank should be. It has a pure and thoughtful shape that’s connected to nature just like a floatation tank should have. It would be an exciting project that I wish to dive deeper into when I have the time.

DL: What is your secret recipe of success in design, what is your secret ingredient?

MB : Do something that hasn’t been done before and combine it with an aesthetically beautiful product that serves a purpose.

DL: Who are some other design masters and legends you get inspired from?

MB : I’ve been inspired by the work of Zaha Hadid for many years. Her work embeds many interesting organic shapes and forms that seem so perfect and are very different from other architects and creators. More recently, I discovered the work of Ross Lovegrove which continues to be a great source of inspiration for me. His creations are peaceful, organic and interesting to me and I believe match well with my own approach to design.

DL: What are your favorite designs by other designers, why do you like them?

MB : I admire the superyacht design by Zaha Hadid Architects. It’s a truly unique, organic and complex design. It reminds me of the kind of sketches I used to make using just ellipses and connecting them to each other through a smooth transition. I loved the way they looked, even though they had no function and were simply abstract creations. A similar design that I feel attracted too, in the same way, is the Coffee Table by Zaha Hadid Architects. It is made of ellipse-type segments that form a coherent entity together. Whenever I look at it, I notice different aspects and elements of the table that I hadn’t noticed before. I very much appreciate and admire these complex organic designs. Another very interesting design that continues to intrigue me is the HU watch by Ross Lovegrove. The cylindrical base of the watch is slightly shifted towards the side, which makes for an unusual yet appealing aesthetic. Its overall design consists of a very minimalistic shape created through an organic design approach that results in what I believe to be a timeless creation that somehow connects to you on a deeper level. I also love the design of the harman/kardon soundsticks speaker designed by Sir Jony Ive that I own. I've even placed the subwoofer on top of my desk instead of under it which decreases the quality of the sound, simply because the design is so intriguing and interesting. There are many more designs that I love, but I would say that the majority are by Zaha Hadid and Ross Lovegrove.

DL: What is your greatest design, which aspects of that design makes you think it is great?

MB : I feel like there are only a handful of designs that I consider to be somewhat completed, naming one the greatest is difficult. I don’t think one of my designs is at a great level yet. But, I like where my designs are going, I can see that there’s an evolution. If I were to choose one of my designs to be the greatest I would choose my clock design Reverse. Perhaps surprisingly, it’s one of the first designs I ever made. I was around 16 at the time. The Reverse clock has been the most successful by far, winning the Golden A’ Design Award in the 2018 – 2019 edition, published numerous times, and people still run up to me and ask about the clock design even though it was created almost four years ago. Even though the geometry of the clock consists of very basic shapes, it has this unique element to it that people seem to love. I think the design is great because it has just the right amount of similarity to existing designs and the right amount of uniqueness. It’s different, yet acceptable.

DL: How could people improve themselves to be better designers, what did you do?

MB : Before I give you my advice, I believe it’s very important to only become a designer if that’s something you want to be doing all day. Don’t do it because of somebody else. If this is what you want to be doing or have been doing for a while, I think it’s good to start reflecting on what you’ve been doing and what you want to achieve. It’s always better to do something with a clear goal in mind instead of simply doing something mindlessly. You don’t need to be the best sketcher, the most creative or the person that comes up with great ideas the quickest. I think it’s also important to understand that you’ve got plenty of time and that your goals may take longer than other people would spend on them, but that’s okay because it’s not a race. I believe a big part of becoming a good designer is all about mindset. After that, ideas and creativity will come and you will know what to do.

DL: If you hadn’t become a designer, what would you have done?

MB : If I had the opportunity, I would choose to become an architect. I’ve always created landscapes and structures with Lego. My friends and family used to think that I would become an architect when I was young. I think industrial design and architecture are very much alike though. So, their predictions were almost right. I do feel lucky to have had the choice to study Industrial Arts in high school, in which there are only two schools in Belgium that offer this kind of course in high school. I happened to study at the school that offered it. If there was no such course, I believe I would have pursued architecture instead of industrial product design.

DL: How do you define design, what is design for you?

MB : For me design is all about imagining something and then creating it, this could be anything. It’s not always about creating something entirely new, sometimes changing a small part of something that already exists can have a big impact.

DL: Who helped you to reach these heights, who was your biggest supporter?

MB : I’m almost certain that I would not be where I am today if it weren’t for my parents. Many small choices that I made because of their suggestions have let me on the path to become a designer. If they weren’t there, I don’t believe I would have discovered my interest in design at such a young age and perhaps only much later in life had the opportunity to pursue it. Many friends, family members, and my partner have helped me along the way and they are still here for me today. It seems as if each family member has their own role in me becoming a designer. They all have their own abilities that they are good at and they are always happy to assist me.

DL: What helped you to become a great designer?

MB : Discovering my passion at a young age, having the opportunity to pursue it, my upbringing, and having an optimistic and open mindset.

DL: What were the obstacles you faced before becoming a design master?

MB : I do not consider myself a design master. I’ve faced many small and mediocre obstacles along the way but the biggest is probably yet to come. Everything seems to be very much on track so far. I think doing the small things each day avoids some of the bigger obstacles in the future.

DL: How do you think designers should present their work?

MB : I think each designer should present their own work in their own way. Sometimes this is very much dependent on the kind of project.

DL: What’s your next design project, what should we expect from you in future?

MB : I’m currently working on a few exciting projects. One of which is a vase design, a simple yet very complex object to design well. I believe the current design I’m working on matches very well with my own design style and personality. I believe it will be a design that many people can appreciate. It’s a modern design, created through an artistic approach that looks pure and elegant and isn’t overwhelming or looks like ‘another vase design’. Another project is an analog watch design. It’s based on the concept of my previous clock design, Reverse. However, it’s not Reverse put into a watch but in a more refined and refreshing way. Only the concept of the reversed hands remains. Lastly, a project that is still in the early stages but looks promising is a portable Bluetooth speaker design. It’s somewhat in the same style as the vase design I’m working on. Simply put, it’s not another Bluetooth speaker design but one that looks very different and is surprisingly practical to use. Next year I hope to present an exciting graduation project in collaboration with the company or design studio at which I will perform my internship. I expect to remain in the industrial design world in the future and will start my own thing, what that will be I don’t yet know. But, it will be in my own design style and you can expect a similar approach to design as I currently have.

DL: What’s your ultimate goal as a designer?

MB : I would like to empower our world through creations that are of significance to humankind and our planet.

DL: What people expect from an esteemed designer such as yourself?

MB : I’m not sure what people expect from me. But it seems as if they usually imagined a similar outcome from the completion of a project or idea. I believe they expect something that’s refreshing, well thought-out and beautifully designed.

DL: How does design help create a better society?

MB : Good design connects people to each other. I think at the end of the day, designs are made from the imagination of people, created because they thought it would be valuable for them or for others. Everything around us was once designed by someone, and most of these things help us every day and allow things to be possible which weren’t possible before. I believe good design creates a better environment for everyone.

DL: What are you currently working on that you are especially excited about?

MB : I’m currently working on a few exciting projects. One of which is a vase design, a simple yet very complex object to design well. I believe the current design I’m working on matches very well with my own design style and personality. I believe it will be a design that many people can appreciate. It’s a modern design, created through an artistic approach that looks pure and elegant and isn’t overwhelming or looks like ‘another vase design’. Another exciting project is an analog watch design. It’s based on the concept of my previous clock design, Reverse. However, it’s not Reverse put into a watch but in a more refined and refreshing way. Only the concept of the reversed hands remains.

DL: Which design projects gave you the most satisfaction, why?

MB : Sphere, a luxurious relaxation area for outdoors, is a design I created as my graduation project in Pikoh high school. I worked on the project for one year. During the design process, I encountered many difficulties and challenges but, in the end, I couldn’t have imagined a better result. I’m almost never completely satisfied with the result of a project. I may think it’s good or even great, but I also think there’s always something to improve it. After the completion of Sphere, I felt as if this was it. Every detail was well thought-out and was the way I wanted it. If I know look back at the project, I would have done many things differently. But, I still believe it was perfect at the time. Because of all the challenges I faced during the creation of Sphere and the completed design that I believed to be near perfect this is by far the project that gave me the most satisfaction. Furthermore, I also won the GIP Awards and finished 1st place with Sphere. This confirmed that not only I was pleased with the design, but others also appreciated it. It was the ideal completion of my graduation project.

DL: What would you like to see changed in design industry in the coming years?

MB : I’m not sure what the industry is like right now because I have limited experience in it. But I would like to suggest the following. I would like to see more companies and studios focus on creating designs that have a place in our society and aren’t another copy of a product that already exists. I believe new designs should have an added value to them that make them relevant and aren’t solely focused on profits. It would be a great world to live in.

DL: Where do you think the design field is headed next?

MB : Everything seems to evolve into the digital world. With the use of AI, many designers and engineers are already experimenting with generative and procedural design methodologies. I expect to see this evolve towards a much higher level in which many elements of the design will be replaced. However, some designs may never be able to be recreated by AI. Such creations I believe will embody the personality of the creator and connect to people emotionally on a much deeper level than they do now.

DL: How long does it take you to finalize a design project?

MB : This varies greatly from project to project. The project I’ve worked the longest on was my high school graduation project called Sphere in Industrial Arts. The project was designed over a one-year period. This was mainly because of its complexity and the depth the design was executed on. On the other hand, the shortest project I’ve worked on from beginning to end was my Liquid table design that won a Bronze A’ Design Award in the 2018 – 2019 edition. The project took about a week. I quickly came to an idea of a table design, that I believed needed no further iterations and looked just right. It was the first and until now the only time that my first idea became the finished product without any changes to its design. It’s one of those rare moments.

DL: When you have a new design project, where do you start?

MB : I start imagining what the design could be and should look like. I prefer doing this before researching anything about the subject or looking at existing designs. This allows me to come up with refreshing ideas and different approaches. For me, this is the part that mostly affects the designs I create and whether it fits myself as a designer.

DL: What is your life motto as a designer?

MB : Create something that’s different, useful and has this ‘extra’ element over existing designs.

DL: Do you think design sets the trends or trends set the designs?

MB : I don’t think it’s one of the two, but rather a combination of them. I also believe this depends on what area of the design industry you are active in. Some companies and design studios set trends while others follow them. I do believe that globally speaking, designs are influenced by trends so that the design is more appealing to the customer. In my own designs, I tend to do my own thing and not look at trends at all. This is because trends don’t last, and I would prefer my designs to last and have their own personality and style. Perhaps a designer who has their own brand will not be influenced by trends as much as other companies.

DL: What is the role of technology when you design?

MB : Technology is a tool to realize my designs. Sometimes you are restricted by it, but at other times it opens doors to new possibilities. I experiment with different kinds of software to see what I can create, and sometimes I stumble upon interesting new techniques I hadn’t thought of using before. I use various technologies throughout my design process to visualize, model, present and explore. My favorite technology is 3d printing. It enables you to design just about anything without restrictions and allows you to print it right away.

DL: What kind of design software and equipment do you use in your work?

MB : I use a variety of software. I mostly use NX for modeling, Keyshot for rendering and Photoshop for retouching. I own a Creality CR-10S which is a very basic 3D printer, that requires a lot of maintenance but is a big help in my design process. When making physical prototypes, I work with PU foam, some carving tools, and simple sanding paper. I’ve even used Oasis foam to create quick prototypes. Sometimes I use Epoxy and glass fibers for more advanced prototypes. Other things I use include simple tools most people have in their homes.

DL: What is the role of the color, materials and ambient in design?

MB : Ambient is very important in my own designs. I try to create a certain ambient through the use of specific colors, materials, and shapes. Throughout my design process, I get let by the ambient that I want my design to emanate, it’s my primary guideline. Most choices I make are based upon this goal. I decide on the kind of ambient I want to recreate at the very beginning of my design process.

DL: What do you wish people to ask about your design?

MB : I would like some more in-depth questions about my work. Questions I need to think about and haven’t really thought about myself yet, those questions are interesting. It would be an interesting dialogue.

DL: When you see a new great design or product what comes into your mind?

MB : What a great creation it is. I wonder how it’s made and what it’s used for. I sometimes look up the designer or company that made it to view other projects by them.

DL: Who is your ideal design partner? Do you believe in co-design?

MB : My ideal design partner is someone who thinks differently than me but still has the same goals and values and operates on the same wavelength. I prefer to design on my own or with a team that helps me instead of co-designing a product with the end-user during the complete development. However, testing your product with the end user throughout the design process prevents unexpected problems and is, therefore, an essential part. I believe in other areas of design, for example in the medical industry, co-design is very relevant and a great idea. But in the products I design, it’s not a necessity to co-design during the entire design process but instead only in specific parts.

DL: Which people you interacted had the most influence on your design?

MB : The work of Zaha Hadid and Ross Lovegrove have had a great influence on my design, even though I haven’t had any or limited interaction with them. I tend to lean more towards the organic and dynamic style of Zaha Hadid’s creations even though it doesn’t always fit well with my own design style. I simply find them very interesting and beautiful. I haven’t had many good results with incorporating some elements of her style with mine, but I’m certain that some part of it has a value to my own style. The work of Ross Lovegrove has had a similar effect on my work. However, his style is a lot more like mine I believe. I’m not yet sure why I’m so attracted to his creations but I’m almost certain that there’s something there that I’m unconsciously looking for. Perhaps, by studying their work, and trying to design products that lean more to their style, I get further away from my own. I’m not sure yet, but it’s an interesting adventure and only one way to find out.

DL: Which books you read had the most effect on your design?

MB : Convergence by designer Ross Lovegrove and The Complete Zaha Hadid book have had a great effect on the way I look at design. I realized, what may be obvious to some, that their designs are executed on a far deeper level than most others. It made me think about my own creations and what meaning they really have and made me explore my own design philosophy on a deeper level. Its effect is becoming visible in my more recent work. There’s a story behind its existing, the shape, the materials and the way you use it. It’s a work in progress, which may never finish, but because of reading these books I now have a better understanding of my own work and the ability and knowledge of what direction it can evolve to.

DL: How did you develop your skills as a master designer?

MB : I have been raised in a very creative environment that was stimulated by my parents since birth. Throughout the years I’ve continued to be interested in building and designing things. For some years I was less active, but the interest in design and creating never went away. At the age of 14, I attended The Academy of Fine Arts in Hasselt, Belgium as an additional course of study to learn Digital Arts with some friends of mine. This was the moment I first come in contact with software such as Photoshop and Illustrator. The course also included traditional drawing, sketching and occasionally building things. Around the same time, I changed from school to study Architecture and Fine Arts at Pikoh high school in Hasselt, Belgium. It had been a while since I last painted, sketched or physically build things. So, I wasn’t that great at it in the beginning. After studying Architecture and Fine Arts for two years I eventually got a lot better in it and the skills I had when I was little were coming back while I learned many new ones. This combined with the interest of my fellow students let to more confidence in my work and in turn, made it better. After this course, I studied Industrial Arts in the same school. This course was the first time I really came in contact with design. The course itself focused on designing products from start to finish. Many people seemed to like my designs and thought I was a good designer. During the first year, I developed many new skills and created a better understanding of what design is and how to design something myself. This was the year that I designed the Reverse clock that won the Golden A’ Design Award in the 2018-2019 edition. The second, and last year of high school I worked on my graduation project. It was a one-year project in which I had to design a product of choice that was ready for production. This project was especially difficult and challenging. It’s the time I had to put all the skills I learned previously to work which often wasn’t enough. Through trial and error, educating myself, and having a clear goal in my mind I eventually finished the project. It was very well received by the jury, teachers and fellow students. This project thought me many things because I had to do everything myself and had no clue of how things worked and could be done. Shortly after my graduation show, I finished 1st place with the project in the GIP Awards 2017 which is a national award for the best graduation project in engineering, design, and innovation. It was a big moment in my life as a designer. I learned many new things and became more confident in my ability to design. Currently, I’m studying Industrial Product Design at Howest University in Kortrijk, Belgium. A course in which I’m designing dozens of products and learning more about myself as a designer and my own design philosophy. Throughout these years of study, I always strived for a great result, one I was happy with and I took the time to perfect all the details. I was lucky that I had people around me that would help me whenever I needed it. Design became a passion, one which I am happy to put all the time I have in. I believe I developed the skills to become a good designer because of the creative environment I was raised in, the luck of finding my passion early in life and having the ability to pursue it.

DL: Irrelative of time and space, who you would want to meet, talk and discuss with?

MB : I would love to have a conversation with Elon Musk, Ross Lovegrove and Tom Bilyeu. I think Elon Musk is one of the greatest people alive today. He is often criticized by many people but he deserves much more appreciation. He’s a person who I believe is putting all his time and effort into helping the planet and humanity. I would love to have a conversation with him about his views and get an insight into his world. Furthermore, I would like to meet Ross Lovegrove and get to know him and talk about what he wants to achieve through his work and why he creates his designs in a specific way. I would like to create a better understanding of the underlying reason for his work. It’s an ideal way for me to learn. I prefer to understand something or someone rather than learning specific things about a topic or person. Because when I understand it, I can recreate it and incorporate it into my own. Lastly, I would like to meet Tom Bilyeu and have a conversation about my views on life and myself and get his opinion on it.

DL: How do you feel about all the awards and recognition you had, is it hard to be famous?

MB : I appreciate the interest of others in my work and myself as a designer. I hope to bring my designs to the people that are interested in them in the near future. For me, the awards simply serve as a confirmation of good design to myself as well as getting recognized by companies to possibly realize the designs. I would rather have my work be famous than myself. Inevitably, for me, it’s about what I create for others, not myself. If the work is famous, it’s most likely a good design that people appreciate. That’s most important to me.

DL: What is your favorite color, place, food, season, thing and brand?

MB : I’ve long loved red, then changed to blue and recently green. But now I feel more like loving IKB, International Klein Blue. It’s a deep blue hue first mixed by the French artist Yves Klein. A beautiful color that has a lot of depth to it. As for a place, I don’t have a name, but I would describe it as a place in the mountains surrounded by green trees, beautiful fresh green grass, a lake in the distance and nothing but the sound of the wind and water. There are many dishes that I love, but there’s nothing like a freshly made Pasta alla Norma. I also prefer the spring, it’s not too hot and not too cold. I’m not a person who’s much busy with brands apart from industrial design brands, but the clothing of the brand G-star always fits nicely like no other. Lastly, a thing that I always have with me is a pencil. It can be any pencil, as long as I can draw and write with it.

DL: Please tell us a little memoir, a funny thing you had experienced as a designer?

MB : I’ve had many small funny experiences these past years with friends and colleagues. Many that are difficult to recall but I remember with whom I had them. I should remember these moments better, maybe I will recall them once I’m finished with a couple of projects.

DL: What makes your day great as a designer, how do you motivate yourself?

MB : A great day is when there are results. Sometimes this can be in the design of a project but at other times simply someone telling me they like what I do. Because things don’t always go as planned, I focus mostly on what I want to create, and not the current situation. I imagine what I want the project to be in the end and that’s usually enough to keep going.

DL: When you were a little child, was it obvious that you would become a great designer?

MB : I used to build landscapes, buildings and many other things from my own imagination with Lego and K’nex. People liked what I created. My parents thought I would become an architect. That didn’t end up happening, but a designer is very much alike. So, becoming a designer wasn’t unexpected for most people.

DL: What do you think about future; what do you see will happen in thousand years from now?

MB : I think technology and products wouldn’t be as visible anymore as they are now. We have all these gadgets, products, and extensions right now. I think in the future these will be implemented in a different way that would give the impression that people live simpler lives. However, I suspect we would be far more advanced. I hope that people would not live in such divided groups as we do now, but rather communicate with all others. I hope we won’t have to wait a thousand years for that to happen. But such things take time I believe. It would be interesting to see how society would grow in the future. Perhaps some of use will be able to experience it through the advanced of technology or by different means. It wouldn’t surprise me, even though it might seem as far-fetched right now.

DL: Please tell us anything you wish your fans to know about you, your design and anything else?

MB : I hope to bring new ideas, creations and other things to the world that people are grateful for. Your interest and feedback means a lot to me and only further improves the work that I create. I would like to thank my family, partner, friends, and acquaintances who have helped me throughout the years and for their interest and continued support. I would also like to thank all the people that have shown interest in my work and me as a designer, whether I know them personally or not.